Legislature(2021 - 2022)ADAMS 519

01/31/2022 01:30 PM House FINANCE

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01:38:20 PM Start
01:39:53 PM Presentation: Savings Account/budget Reserves/investment Funds
02:48:57 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ Presentation: Savings Accounts, Budget TELECONFERENCED
Reserves and Investment Funds by Pam Leary,
State Investment Officer, Department of Revenue
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                  HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                                                                       
                     January 31, 2022                                                                                           
                         1:38 p.m.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:38:20 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CALL TO ORDER                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Foster called the House Finance Committee meeting                                                                      
to order at 1:38 p.m.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Neal Foster, Co-Chair                                                                                            
Representative Kelly Merrick, Co-Chair (via teleconference)                                                                     
Representative Dan Ortiz, Vice-Chair                                                                                            
Representative Ben Carpenter                                                                                                    
Representative Bryce Edgmon                                                                                                     
Representative DeLena Johnson                                                                                                   
Representative Bart LeBon                                                                                                       
Representative Sara Rasmussen (via teleconference)                                                                              
Representative Steve Thompson                                                                                                   
Representative Adam Wool                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Representative Andy Josephson                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
ALSO PRESENT                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Brian Fechter, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Revenue;                                                                      
Pam Leary, Director, Treasury Division, Department of                                                                           
Revenue.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SUMMARY                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
PRESENTATION: SAVINGS ACCOUNT/BUDGET RESERVES/INVESTMENT                                                                        
FUNDS                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Foster reviewed the meeting agenda.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
^PRESENTATION: SAVINGS ACCOUNT/BUDGET RESERVES/INVESTMENT                                                                     
FUNDS                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:39:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
BRIAN FECHTER,  DEPUTY COMMISSIONER,  DEPARTMENT OF  REVENUE,                                                                   
introduced himself.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
PAM  LEARY,   DIRECTOR,  TREASURY  DIVISION,   DEPARTMENT  OF                                                                   
REVENUE, provided  a PowerPoint  presentation titled  "Update                                                                   
on  Investment  Funds  and Cash  Flows,"  dated  January  31,                                                                   
2022.  She  began  on  slide   3  with  an  update  on  state                                                                   
investment  funds. She  planned to  discuss historical  asset                                                                   
balances  of state  funds  and pension  funds.  Additionally,                                                                   
the  presentation addressed  key  investment statistics.  She                                                                   
noted the funds were all managed at the Treasury.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:41:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary moved  to slide 4 and reviewed a  chart showing the                                                                   
Constitutional  Budget Reserve  Fund  (CBRFF) and  historical                                                                   
invested  assets since  inception in 1990.  The blue  section                                                                   
of  the  chart  reflected  the  main  fund,  and  the  yellow                                                                   
section reflected  the sub-fund.  She noted the  sub-fund had                                                                   
been created in  2000, but substantially funded  in 2008 with                                                                   
a  $4.1 billion  deposit. The  CBRFF  had been  used to  fund                                                                   
temporary  cashflow  expenses   as  well  as  budget  revenue                                                                   
shortfalls.  She detailed  that  $960 million  from the  fund                                                                   
had been used in  2021 to help with a revenue  shortfall. She                                                                   
highlighted  appropriations from  the fund  were required  to                                                                   
be repaid.  As of  the FY 20  year end financial  statements,                                                                   
the fund  was owed  $12.8 billion. She  relayed there  was no                                                                   
time  period for  the repayment  and no  interest accrued  to                                                                   
the fund.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:42:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  advanced  to  slide   5  showing  key  investment                                                                   
statistics. Currently  the CBRFF target asset  allocation was                                                                   
funded  to   100  percent   cash  equivalents  (i.e.,   money                                                                   
markets,  treasury  bills, etcetera).  The  fund  had a  very                                                                   
short investment  horizon, meaning the Department  of Revenue                                                                   
(DOR) anticipated  funds could  be used  within a  very short                                                                   
time period.  As of December 31,  2021, the market  value was                                                                   
nearly $1.1  billion. She noted  the slide showed  the fund's                                                                   
market value history  for the past five years. As  of the end                                                                   
of December,  the rolling  one-year return  was 0.09  percent                                                                   
and the  short-term projected  return for  the year  was 0.05                                                                   
percent.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon stated it  was his understanding  that                                                                   
the CBRF was  the state's checking account.  He detailed that                                                                   
money flowed in  and out of the account monthly  to deal with                                                                   
needs around the state.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  clarified that  the  General  Fund acted  as  the                                                                   
state's the  checking account  and the  CBRF was the  savings                                                                   
fund.  She explained  that money  had  been transferred  from                                                                   
the CBRF to the  General Fund in the past five  years to make                                                                   
the state's payments.  She noted that the CBRF  was sometimes                                                                   
referred to as the "rainy day" fund.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon believed  that  in the  past the  CBRF                                                                   
had  been used  as a  source to  fund the  state's needs  for                                                                   
cash flow  purposes.  He remarked  he had  been at the  House                                                                   
Finance  Committee  table  when  the  discussions  had  taken                                                                   
place.  He stated  that no one  could answer  how much  money                                                                   
should  be in  the account  to provide  certainty funds  were                                                                   
available in the  event of a drop in oil prices  or other. He                                                                   
highlighted  appropriating  funds from  the  CBRF required  a                                                                   
three-quarter vote  by the legislature. He remarked  that DOR                                                                   
did not need  the legislature's approval to use  funds in the                                                                   
short-term on  a monthly basis.  He stated that  a frequently                                                                   
asked question was  how much money should be in  the CBRF. He                                                                   
wondered  if an  $800  million balance  was  sufficient as  a                                                                   
safeguard if the  Higher Education Investment  Fund was lost.                                                                   
He  wondered whether  the balance  should be  higher in  case                                                                   
oil prices fell.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:46:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter replied  that DOR was comfortable  with a balance                                                                   
of  about   $1  billion  for   cash  flow.  He   relayed  the                                                                   
department  considered   the  amount  to  be   sufficient  to                                                                   
weather two  years of  oil price  volatility. He noted  there                                                                   
would be  additional detail  later in  the presentation.  The                                                                   
presentation  would  address revenue  anticipation  borrowing                                                                   
and  other mechanisms  to  assist  the state  if  it was  not                                                                   
possible to maintain a $1 billion minimum CBRF balance.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Ortiz  asked  if  the  December  31,  2021,  CBRF                                                                   
balance  of approximately  $1.1 billion  reflected the  sweep                                                                   
balance.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary answered  in the  negative,  the amount  reflected                                                                   
cash  balance   only.  She  elaborated   that  the   June  30                                                                   
sweepable  fund transfer  had  not yet  been done  on a  cash                                                                   
basis.  The   department  was  awaiting  guidance   from  the                                                                   
state's  annual financial  report coming  out in February  to                                                                   
help  identify  where funds  should  be  moving and  in  what                                                                   
amounts.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:48:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.   Leary   addressed   Power   Cost   Equalization   (PCE)                                                                   
historical  invested assets  on  slide 6.  She detailed  that                                                                   
the PCE  Endowment Fund  had been funded  in 2000,  2007, and                                                                   
2012.  The  purpose  of  the   fund  was  to  provide  stable                                                                   
financing  for affordable  levels of  electric utility  costs                                                                   
in  otherwise  high-cost  service  areas of  the  state.  She                                                                   
relayed that the  target allocation had moved  from 7 percent                                                                   
to 5 percent,  which coincided with  a change to a  5 percent                                                                   
percent of  market value (POMV)  appropriation for  the fund.                                                                   
She  detailed  that  if  prior  year  earnings  exceeded  the                                                                   
target,  70  percent of  the  difference  could be  spent  on                                                                   
related identified  programs, including community  assistance                                                                   
programs, renewable  energy grants,  and bulk fuel  revolving                                                                   
loan  funds.  She  noted  the amount  could  not  exceed  $55                                                                   
million annually.  The amount had  been $1.15 billion  at the                                                                   
end of June 30.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary discussed  PCE Fund investment statistics  on slide                                                                   
7.  She detailed  that  the fund  was  longer-term [than  the                                                                   
CBRF] with an  intermediate investment horizon.  The fund was                                                                   
targeted  with  a  higher  risk  return  with  a  56  percent                                                                   
equity/44  percent bond asset  allocation. As  of the  end of                                                                   
December,  the market value  was about  $1.1 billion  and one                                                                   
year return  was 7.12 percent.  The projected  10-year return                                                                   
was 5 percent.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:51:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  advanced to  slide  8  and discussed  the  Alaska                                                                   
Higher Education  Investment Fund. The fund had  been created                                                                   
in 2012 with  a capitalization of $400 million.  She detailed                                                                   
that the  fund was  to be  swept as  of June  30 and DOR  was                                                                   
awaiting  guidance. She  elaborated that  the fund was  still                                                                   
invested  as  it  had  been  previously.  Once  DOR  received                                                                   
guidance, it  would determine how  the funds could  move over                                                                   
to the CBRF.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary moved  to slide  9  showing investment  statistics                                                                   
for the Higher  Education Investment Fund. She  detailed that                                                                   
the fund  was invested  for a  high risk  return with  a long                                                                   
investment horizon  (despite any  forthcoming changes  to the                                                                   
fund). As of the  end of December, the fund  balance was $422                                                                   
million,  the one-year  return  was  12.55 percent,  and  the                                                                   
projected 10-year return was 5.62 percent.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool asked  for  the withdrawal  rate on  the                                                                   
Higher Education  Investment Fund.  He asked  if there  was a                                                                   
set formula. He  observed the fund had been  capitalized with                                                                   
$400  million  in  2012  and the  current  balance  was  $422                                                                   
million.  He  asked  how  much of  the  earnings  were  taken                                                                   
annually.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary believed  the allowable  appropriation amount  was                                                                   
up  to   7  percent  annually.   She  estimated   the  annual                                                                   
withdrawal amount  to be  in the $30  million to  $40 million                                                                   
range.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter  added that  the amount varied  but tended  to be                                                                   
$30 million to $40 million per year.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Representative Wool  asked if the spend was based  on need by                                                                   
the  given   number  of  students.   He  observed   that  the                                                                   
projected  10-year   return  was  5.62  percent,   while  the                                                                   
appropriation amount  could be up  to 7 percent.  He wondered                                                                   
whether  it  depended  on  how   many  students  applied  and                                                                   
qualified.  He added that  he certainly  wanted the  funds to                                                                   
go out.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:54:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter  answered that  over the years  there had  been a                                                                   
number of discussions  about the long-term  sustainability of                                                                   
the withdrawal rate.  He relayed the money was  only spent if                                                                   
there were enough  seats in the Washington,  Wyoming, Alaska,                                                                   
Montana, and  Idaho (WWAMI)  program and students  qualifying                                                                   
for  the [performance]  scholarship.  He  explained that  any                                                                   
unspent  funds at the  end of  a year  would lapse  back into                                                                   
the  Higher Education  Investment  Fund.  He elaborated  that                                                                   
the  Office   of  Management   and  Budget   (OMB)  and   the                                                                   
Legislative  Finance  Division   (LFD)  were  monitoring  the                                                                   
situation  on an ongoing  basis  to ensure  the fund was  not                                                                   
drawn beyond its long-term earning capability.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Thompson   remarked   that   10   additional                                                                   
students were being  added to the WWAMI program.  He asked if                                                                   
it  would have  a substantial  impact  on the  draw from  the                                                                   
fund.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter responded  that because  many  of the  sweepable                                                                   
funds  had  been   swept,  the  governor  had   replaced  the                                                                   
spending items with  unrestricted general funds  (UGF) in his                                                                   
proposed  budget.  He  explained  that  it would  not  be  an                                                                   
additional  draw from  the Higher  Education Investment  Fund                                                                   
because in  theory it had  already swept. The  administration                                                                   
viewed the  situation as  positive for  some of the  students                                                                   
because there  was a  cost benefit  between General  Fund and                                                                   
Higher  Education Investment  Fund funding  of the  programs.                                                                   
He expounded  that because  the fund  was designated  general                                                                   
fund (DGF)  it did not receive  the level of scrutiny  that a                                                                   
UGF appropriation  would. On the other hand,  funding through                                                                   
DGF made it  susceptible to the three-quarter  reverse sweep.                                                                   
The  department   believed  funding  the  program   with  UGF                                                                   
provided  a  bit of  certainty  to  students relying  on  the                                                                   
scholarships.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Thompson  referenced  a pending  lawsuit.  He                                                                   
provided a scenario  where the lawsuit reversed  the sweep of                                                                   
the funds  back into  the Higher  Education Investment  Fund.                                                                   
He asked  if it was necessary  to add language to  the budget                                                                   
stating  that the  funding source  would be  reversed if  the                                                                   
lawsuit were to occur.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter answered  the question was purely  mechanical and                                                                   
related to  the budget  structure, which was  at the  will of                                                                   
the legislature.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:57:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon thought it  was an excellent  point in                                                                   
terms of  a contingency  measure because  the outcome  of the                                                                   
court  case was  not  yet known.  He  asked for  verification                                                                   
that  the funds  would  remain  in the  CBRF  if the  lawsuit                                                                   
determined the Higher Education Investment Fund was swept.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary replied affirmatively.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Representative Edgmon  remarked that the program  had started                                                                   
in  2013,  but  he  did  not  believe  the  Higher  Education                                                                   
Investment Fund  had been considered  sweepable in  its first                                                                   
six  to  eight  years.  He asked  if  his  understanding  was                                                                   
accurate.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter replied  that he  would  have to  look into  the                                                                   
question.  He noted  there had  been a  number of  iterations                                                                   
across  multiple   administrations   about  what   the  legal                                                                   
analysis of the moment deemed sweepable or not sweepable.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon believed  his  previous statement  was                                                                   
accurate.  He stated  that  the Dunleavy  administration  had                                                                   
determined  the fund  to be sweepable,  but  it had not  been                                                                   
considered   sweepable   during   the   Parnell   or   Walker                                                                   
administrations.   He  remarked   there   was  an   uncertain                                                                   
arbitrary nature in  terms of what was or  was not sweepable.                                                                   
He highlighted that  if the courts decided the  fund was part                                                                   
of the  CBRF and was  to be swept,  it meant the  legislature                                                                   
had to come up  with the money annually. He  pointed out that                                                                   
it was  adding $20  million or  more to  the budget  annually                                                                   
because  the  legislature's  only  recourse was  to  pay  the                                                                   
money out of UGF. He asked if he was missing something.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:59:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter  agreed  that  in  the  absence  of  having  the                                                                   
endowment  to  fund  the  programs,  another  funding  source                                                                   
would  need to  be  identified. In  the  current budget,  the                                                                   
governor had selected UGF.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon observed  that the change  effectively                                                                   
meant  switching  the  $400  million  pot of  money  from  an                                                                   
expected  return   rate  of  5.6   percent  [in   the  Higher                                                                   
Education  Investment Fund]  to a  rate of  0.05 percent  [in                                                                   
the CBRF]. He remarked that it was unfortunate.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair  Ortiz referenced  Representative Wool's  question                                                                   
related to  the amount withdrawn  from the account  annually.                                                                   
He  highlighted that  Mr. Fechter  had stated  the number  of                                                                   
people  who qualify  for the  scholarship fund  or the  WWAMI                                                                   
program had an  impact on the withdrawal amount.  He asked if                                                                   
the  number of  individuals receiving  funding  could be  cut                                                                   
off  at a  certain  point in  order  to maintain  the  fund's                                                                   
health and avoid  an overdraw. Alternatively,  he wondered if                                                                   
it  was  purely   dictated  by  the  number   of  people  who                                                                   
qualified each year.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter  believed it  was a flat  dollar amount  put into                                                                   
the  budget  where  the Department  of  Education  and  Early                                                                   
Development   and   Alaska   Commission    on   Postsecondary                                                                   
Education (ACPE)  developed an estimate of the  amount needed                                                                   
to fully  fulfill the  earned scholarships  and WWAMI  slots.                                                                   
He  elaborated  that if  student  numbers  came in  low,  the                                                                   
money would  remain in the  fund for future  use. Conversely,                                                                   
he believed  there  was a buffer  built into  the numbers  if                                                                   
the student  numbers came  in high. The  buffer was  aimed at                                                                   
avoiding a situation  where there were more  obligations than                                                                   
spending   authority.  He  noted   the  supplemental   budget                                                                   
process was an option as well.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:01:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool remarked  that 10  to 20 WWAMI  students                                                                   
represented  a small  portion of  the overall  fund draw.  He                                                                   
surmised   the  majority   of   the  fund   recipients   were                                                                   
undergraduate   students   at   the  University   of   Alaska                                                                   
Fairbanks.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter confirmed  that the  lion's share  of the  funds                                                                   
went to  the performance  scholarship recipients  and largely                                                                   
prospective  University of  Alaska students.  Over the  years                                                                   
there had been  some off-designation appropriations  from the                                                                   
fund.  For example,  one  year, the  funding  for the  Public                                                                   
Employees'   Retirement    System   (PERS)    and   Teachers'                                                                   
Retirement  System (TRS)  pension obligations  came from  the                                                                   
fund. He  elaborated that  periodically  over the years  some                                                                   
related  programs  such as  Online  with Libraries  and  Live                                                                   
Homework Help had  been appropriated from the  fund. He noted                                                                   
it  depended  on   the  year  and  how  the   budget  process                                                                   
progressed.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool stated  that he  had not  been aware  of                                                                   
the anomalies. He  stated that perhaps the  appropriation use                                                                   
was  perfectly  within  the  defined  use  of  the  fund.  He                                                                   
referenced a  line item in  the FY 23  budget to fund  all of                                                                   
the scholarships  without  the withdrawal  from the  fund. He                                                                   
remarked  that if  the fund was  swept, it  would contain  no                                                                   
earnings  available to  pay for the  scholarships. He  stated                                                                   
the  amount  currently  in the  budget  was  for  performance                                                                   
scholarships and WWAMI. He asked for the number.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter replied  that he did not have the  number on hand                                                                   
but  would  follow up  with  the  information. He  noted  the                                                                   
figure was  in the normal  range. He  added that a  few seats                                                                   
had been  added to the WWAMI  program; therefore,  the amount                                                                   
would be an uptick from the previous year.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative Wool  asked if paying  PERS and TRS  and other                                                                   
things  from  the  fund  was an  anomaly  or  something  that                                                                   
occurred more frequently.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter answered  that the  payment  had occurred  under                                                                   
the   previous  administration   and  was   an  anomaly.   He                                                                   
elaborated  that for the  most part,  the legislature  tended                                                                   
to stick with  designations written in statute.  He furthered                                                                   
that   occasionally  for   ease  of   budgeting  there   were                                                                   
anomalous funding events.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool could  understand  how online  libraries                                                                   
could be  attached to education.  He thought paying  for PERS                                                                   
and TRS was a larger leap.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon remarked  that the  state was  looking                                                                   
at  having  some surplus  funding  in  the current  year.  He                                                                   
asked if  it would take statutory  change to put some  of the                                                                   
surplus funding  into the  Higher Education Investment  Fund.                                                                   
He  did  not  believe  the  action  would  require  statutory                                                                   
change;  however, he believed  expanding  the purpose  of the                                                                   
fund would likely take statutory language.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter agreed  that  changing  the designation  of  the                                                                   
fund  would  take  a statutory  change.  He  noted  that  the                                                                   
legislature  was  permitted to  spend  funds  outside of  the                                                                   
designation  due to  the anti-dedicated  funds clause  within                                                                   
the state constitution.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:06:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon  stated  his  understanding  that  the                                                                   
legislature  would not  be prohibited  from capitalizing  the                                                                   
fund further.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter agreed.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  advanced to slide  10 showing historical  invested                                                                   
assets  of   the  General   Fund  and  Other   Non-Segregated                                                                   
Investments (GeFONSI).  She explained there were  two GeFONSI                                                                   
components.  She  detailed that  GEFONSI  II  was created  in                                                                   
2018 to target  a higher risk return profile for  a subset of                                                                   
funds. There  were approximately  180 funds managed  together                                                                   
in the  two GeFONSI components,  but they were  accounted for                                                                   
separately.  As of December  31, 2021,  there was  about $3.5                                                                   
billion  in total  GeFONSI  funds.  She elaborated  that  the                                                                   
General Fund was  included in the group of  GeFONSI funds and                                                                   
had been  about $1.6  billion  at the end  of June;  however,                                                                   
the  fund had  been reduced  to  about $600  million by  July                                                                   
because it was the state's working capital account.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:08:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  turned to  investment statistics  on slide  11 for                                                                   
GeFONSI I  and II investments.  She highlighted  that GeFONSI                                                                   
II  had a  6  percent allocation  to  equity  and a  slightly                                                                   
higher fixed income  allocation slated for a  slightly higher                                                                   
return.  The combined  total in  the  two GeFONSI  components                                                                   
was $2.8  billion  at the end  of December.  The returns  for                                                                   
the year  ending December 31  were -0.35 percent  for GeFONSI                                                                   
I and  0.85  percent for  GeFONSI II.  The short-term  return                                                                   
projections  were  0.27  percent   for  GeFONSI  I  and  0.91                                                                   
percent for GeFONSI II.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Edgmon  referenced   the  location   of  the                                                                   
community  assistance  funds.  He  clarified  he  was  asking                                                                   
about the  fund itself and not  the money that came  from PCE                                                                   
in  the  event  of  a surplus.  He  asked  if  the  community                                                                   
assistance funds resided in the GeFONSI accounts.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary responded affirmatively.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:09:28 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  addressed the  Public School  Trust Fund  on slide                                                                   
12. The fund was  funded by one half of one  percent of state                                                                   
receipts  from   the  management  of  state   lands,  mineral                                                                   
leases, rentals,  and royalties. The fund was  established in                                                                   
1978. She  detailed that  it had  previously been  managed as                                                                   
two  separate  principal  and  interest  funds,  but  it  was                                                                   
currently managed  as one fund. She elaborated  that the fund                                                                   
was  managed  under  a  POMV method.  She  explained  that  5                                                                   
percent  of  the average  market  value  for the  five  years                                                                   
preceding  the last  previous fiscal  year was  used to  make                                                                   
payments  from the  fund to  provide  an offset  to the  K-12                                                                   
formula funding.  The amount was  roughly $32 million  for FY                                                                   
23.                                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool asked  if the  $32 million  was used  to                                                                   
augment other general funds used to fund education.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary agreed.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  turned to  slide  13  showing the  Public  School                                                                   
Trust  Fund  investment  statistics.  The  fund  had  a  long                                                                   
investment  horizon  with a  target  asset allocation  of  69                                                                   
percent equity  and 31 percent  fixed income. As  of December                                                                   
31,  the balance  was $850  million with  a rolling  one-year                                                                   
return  of 12.56  percent, and  a ten-year  target return  of                                                                   
5.62  percent. She  noted the  previous year  there had  been                                                                   
discussion  about  the  introduction of  a  state  investment                                                                   
review board  started by  the DOR  commissioner. She  relayed                                                                   
the board was coming  up on its sixth meeting  to go over the                                                                   
investments  under  the commissioner's  fiduciary  care.  She                                                                   
elaborated  that  the  Investment Advisory  Council  for  the                                                                   
state's   pension   funds   had   been   providing   guidance                                                                   
separately to  the state funds.  She explained  that meetings                                                                   
included  discussion  on  the asset  allocations.  She  noted                                                                   
that meeting  information and  minutes were available  on the                                                                   
DOR website.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:12:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary advanced  to slide  14  showing historical  assets                                                                   
for  PERS  and  TRS  including  pension  and  health  Defined                                                                   
Benefit  plans,  totaling $31.7  billion  on June  30,  2021.                                                                   
Slide  15 showed  investment allocations  for the  retirement                                                                   
funds. She highlighted  there was a much more  diverse target                                                                   
asset allocation  for the retirement  funds when  compared to                                                                   
many of  the state  funds. She detailed  that 49  percent was                                                                   
allocated  to public  equity,  30  percent was  allocated  to                                                                   
private  equity,  and  21  percent  was  allocated  to  fixed                                                                   
income. At  the end of December,  assets for  defined benefit                                                                   
and health  care plan were $22.5  billion for PERS  and $10.8                                                                   
billion for  TRS. She  pointed to  the 24.64 percent  returns                                                                   
at  the end  of September,  which  were  calculated by  DOR's                                                                   
performance consultant  Callan Associates. She noted  that as                                                                   
of  December,  DOR's  internal  returns  were  closer  to  19                                                                   
percent.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:14:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary discussed  cash flows  on slide  17. She  reminded                                                                   
committee  members  that  the  Cash  Management  Section  and                                                                   
Treasury Division  managed all  of the banking  relationships                                                                   
and  cash flows  in  and out  of the  state,  in addition  to                                                                   
forecasting  all of the  expected cash  positions on  a daily                                                                   
basis. She  clarified that discussions  about funds  or money                                                                   
movement  within the  Treasury  pertained  to cash  balances,                                                                   
not  the  amounts  in the  annual  financial  report  or  the                                                                   
budget. She  explained that  the cash  balance was  the money                                                                   
in the bank at a given point in time.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:15:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  moved to  an illustration  on slide 18  reflecting                                                                   
money  moving  in  and  out of  the  General  Fund  into  the                                                                   
Division  of Treasury.  Cash  inflows  included tax  revenues                                                                   
and federal  dollars for things  like Medicaid and  grants on                                                                   
their way to various funds.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon   asked  for  verification   that  the                                                                   
initial  Coronavirus  Aid,  Relief,   and  Economic  Security                                                                   
(CARES)  Act federal  funding  had  been deposited  into  the                                                                   
state Treasury in 2020.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary agreed.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon asked  if the  same was expected  with                                                                   
the federal infrastructure money.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter   answered  that   he  would  confer   with  the                                                                   
infrastructure  lead Miles  Baker  and would  follow up  with                                                                   
the committee.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative Edgmon  stated he would be very  interested in                                                                   
the response.  He was interested to  find out if there  was a                                                                   
sense of timing.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:17:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  moved  to  slide   19  and  addressed  cash  flow                                                                   
deficiencies.  She  noted  that   historically  many  of  the                                                                   
incoming  funds  went  into the  General  Fund  and  remained                                                                   
there  for working  capital account  purposes. She  explained                                                                   
that  the monies  were put  into  the budget  to spend  money                                                                   
from the General  Fund for different purposes;  however, many                                                                   
sub-funds had  been created over  time to segregate  cash for                                                                   
specific   purposes,  which   had  resulted   in  less   cash                                                                   
available to  pay day-to-day  operating costs. She  explained                                                                   
that  expenditures  could  occur  prior  to  the  receipt  of                                                                   
revenue,  resulting  in  cash  flow  timing  mismatches.  She                                                                   
highlighted  federal  programs required  expenditures  before                                                                   
reimbursement  for things  like  Medicaid and  transportation                                                                   
costs.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon  asked  if there  were  any  sub-funds                                                                   
associated with the Statutory Budget Reserve (SBR).                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  answered that  the SBR was  part of the  sub-funds                                                                   
within the GeFONSI.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon asked  for verification  that the  SBR                                                                   
was  not considered  sweepable based  on the  court case  the                                                                   
previous August.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary agreed.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool asked  for verification  that a  balance                                                                   
was  needed   in  the  CBRF  in   the  event  of   cash  flow                                                                   
deficiencies. He  surmised funds could be used  from the CBRF                                                                   
when the  state was  short on cash  and repaid when  revenues                                                                   
came in.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary confirmed  the CBRF  was  one of  the sources  for                                                                   
filling  gaps  in  addition  to  the  ERA.  She  intended  to                                                                   
address the issue in more detail later in the presentation.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:19:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary   advanced   to  slide  20   and  discussed   cash                                                                   
deficiency  memorandum   of  understanding   (MOU)  developed                                                                   
between DOR, OMB,  the Department of Administration,  and the                                                                   
Department  of  Law.  She  explained   that  the  MOU  walked                                                                   
through  the process  DOR would  take when  dealing with  the                                                                   
deficiencies.  She   detailed  that  the  target   cash  flow                                                                   
balance had a  floor of $400 million. She  explained that the                                                                   
number had  been developed  over time  and provided  coverage                                                                   
for  two days  of  high volume  outflows  in  the event  cash                                                                   
calls all occurred  at one time. She elaborated  that the MOU                                                                   
addressed temporary  interfund borrowing including  transfers                                                                   
from the SBR,  CBRF, Permanent Fund Earnings  Reserve Account                                                                   
(ERA), or General Fund sub-funds.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary explained  that  the  transfers were  targeted  at                                                                   
temporary   short-term  cash   flow   mismatches  where   DOR                                                                   
anticipated incoming  revenue that would be used  to make the                                                                   
funds  whole again.  She explained  that  in the  event of  a                                                                   
revenue  shortfall without  a backstop  in the budget  bills,                                                                   
measures would  need to  be taken to  address the  issue. The                                                                   
department would  first seek legislative action  [through the                                                                   
governor]   to    access   additional   funds    through   an                                                                   
appropriation,  supplemental,  or  other cash  reserves.  She                                                                   
explained  that  disbursements  may  have to  be  limited  if                                                                   
additional funds could not be secured.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon  recalled   committee  discussion  the                                                                   
previous  summer  about  the   possibility  of  a  government                                                                   
shutdown  and  the administration's  ability  to  move  money                                                                   
around   outside    of   the   legislature's    appropriation                                                                   
authority.  He remarked  that  DOR had  the  ability to  move                                                                   
money around.  He believed  DOR had the  ability to  tap into                                                                   
the CBRF.  He asked  about the  process of  using funds  from                                                                   
the CBRF without an appropriation from the legislature.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:23:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter  believed the  situation  Representative  Edgmon                                                                   
was  referring  to  for  a  variety  of  previous  government                                                                   
shutdown  scenarios spoke  to the  fact that  DOR could  only                                                                   
access  the   CBRF  for  inter-year  cash   flow  "lumpiness"                                                                   
without  the  three-quarter vote  temporarily.  He  explained                                                                   
that  the  method  could  not  be used  to  fill  a  systemic                                                                   
ongoing deficit;  DOR would need  to have some  certainty the                                                                   
revenues  would eventually  come in within  that fiscal  year                                                                   
to use the CBRF as a cash management tool.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon   provided  a  hypothetical   scenario                                                                   
where  the effective  date for  the  annual operating  budget                                                                   
failed to  get the required  two-thirds vote. He  stated that                                                                   
DOR  would still  have some  tools  to move  money around  to                                                                   
cover  expenses  to  some degree  until  the  effective  date                                                                   
naturally  came into  law in 90  days [after  the passage  of                                                                   
the budget].                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter replied  affirmatively,  but  with  a number  of                                                                   
caveats.  He  explained  there  were  borders  for  interfund                                                                   
borrowing.  For example, DOR  could not  borrow more  than it                                                                   
could  anticipate coming  in. For  example, if  there was  an                                                                   
issue  with  funding  appropriations   supported  by  tobacco                                                                   
fund, DOR  could use  the interfund  borrowing tool,  but not                                                                   
to  a  greater  degree  than   anticipated  incoming  tobacco                                                                   
receipts.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon remarked the  state had some  tools at                                                                   
its disposal [to  cover expenses] in the event  the operating                                                                   
budget effective  date clause  did not  pass. He thought  the                                                                   
subject may  bear further examination  by the committee  as a                                                                   
contingency measure  because it was unknown whether  the two-                                                                   
thirds vote could be obtained.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:26:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool  referred   to  Representative  Edgmon's                                                                   
mention of  the potential  for the  effective date  clause to                                                                   
fail.  He   considered  the   situation  was  a   legislative                                                                   
roadblock and  not a cash  flow deficiency. He  remarked that                                                                   
it  was not  a shortage  of  revenue  problem. He  referenced                                                                   
Representative  Edgmon's   statement  that  the   bill  would                                                                   
become  law  after  a  given  number  of  days  [without  the                                                                   
passage  of  the  effective  date].   He  remarked  that  the                                                                   
revenue would  be available, but  the issue was  about giving                                                                   
the  authority  to spend  the  money.  He  thought it  was  a                                                                   
different problem than cash deficiency.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Fechter  agreed it was a  bit of a different  problem and                                                                   
there had  been competing  legal opinions  on the  topic over                                                                   
the years.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool asked if  temporary interfund  borrowing                                                                   
from the  SBR, CBRF, and  ERA was arbitrary  or written  in a                                                                   
descending   order  of   preference.  He   stated  that   the                                                                   
committee  heard  [throughout time]  that  the  CBRF was  the                                                                   
"slush  fund"  where cash  could  be  used  up to  a  certain                                                                   
amount and replaced.  He was not aware the ERA  could be used                                                                   
for that purpose.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  answered  that  it had  changed  over  the  years                                                                   
depending  on  the  department's   borrowing  authority.  She                                                                   
stated  that  with the  ERA  providing  much of  the  state's                                                                   
revenue  for the  past several  years, it  was generally  the                                                                   
first source  DOR utilized at  present unless there  had been                                                                   
an  anticipated  deficit.  For  example,  in  2021,  DOR  had                                                                   
borrowed  money from  the CBRF  first up  to the  anticipated                                                                   
deficit amount.  Subsequently, DOR  had taken money  from the                                                                   
ERA  in order  for the  money to  earn more  with the  Alaska                                                                   
Permanent  Fund Corporation  (APFC)  for a  longer period  of                                                                   
time.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Representative Wool  stated his understanding of  Ms. Leary's                                                                   
response.  He asked  for verification  that the  ERA was  the                                                                   
first  go-to  for  necessary funds  because  it  was  already                                                                   
funding government.  He asked  if it lessened  the importance                                                                   
of  maintaining  a  higher  CBRF   balance.  He  thought  the                                                                   
[recommended]  $1  billion CBRF  balance  was  for cash  flow                                                                   
needs.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  answered she did  not know  that it had  an impact                                                                   
on what  the state wanted  to keep as  a rainy day  fund. She                                                                   
elaborated there  was change continuing to occur  annually in                                                                   
terms of what the  ERA would be used for. She  noted that the                                                                   
amount going to  state government was not  quite decided. She                                                                   
highlighted  the importance  of a  rainy day  fund and  noted                                                                   
there  were many  ways to  calculate what  the amount  should                                                                   
be.  The current  view was  the  balance should  be about  $1                                                                   
billion.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative Wool  stated that having a rainy  day fund was                                                                   
an appropriate and  apt concern. He recalled  when oil prices                                                                   
had  been in  the negative.  He thought  the situation  would                                                                   
potentially  qualify  as a  need  for a  rainy  day fund  and                                                                   
other circumstances.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:31:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  moved to  slide 21 and  continued to  discuss cash                                                                   
flow deficiencies.  The use of budget reserve  funds had been                                                                   
the   solution  for   cash   flow  mismatches   and   revenue                                                                   
shortfalls for  many years. She  noted that the  solution had                                                                   
shifted  more  to the  ERA.  She  highlighted that  the  CBRF                                                                   
balance  had been  fully  repaid by  2010  and borrowing  had                                                                   
recommenced in  FY 15. As of  the annual financial  report in                                                                   
FY 20, the amount owed to the CBRF was $12.8 billion.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Representative Edgmon  recalled there was no  requirement for                                                                   
a payment plan  or a date. He described money  owed as a "big                                                                   
IOU out there" with really no specificity attached.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary agreed.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool asked for  verification that  paying the                                                                   
$12.8  billion back  would  not  really change  anything.  He                                                                   
surmised  it  meant  there would  be  $12.8  billion  sitting                                                                   
there [in  the CBRF] that the  legislature could use  for the                                                                   
next rainy day.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter agreed.  He detailed  it  was a  debt the  state                                                                   
owed  itself.  To  the extent  there  were  ongoing  deficits                                                                   
annually, it  would make the need  to balance the CBRF  go on                                                                   
in  perpetuity. Whereas,  if a  sustainable  fiscal plan  was                                                                   
achieved  resulting in  a balanced  budget,  the $12  billion                                                                   
would far  exceed the  amount needed  for revenue  volatility                                                                   
management.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:33:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon  remarked  the situation  was  another                                                                   
example of  how the legislature  was bound by laws  passed in                                                                   
a different  era. He  believed the  CBRF language  had passed                                                                   
in   1990.   He   highlighted   that   if   the   legislature                                                                   
recapitalized the  $12.8 billion,  it would be  foregoing the                                                                   
ability  to put  money  in  the Higher  Education  Investment                                                                   
Fund (with  a 5.62  percent target  return) or putting  money                                                                   
into the  ERA that  earned close to  30 percent  the previous                                                                   
year. He  pointed out  that from  an investment  perspective,                                                                   
the situation was a little out of kilter.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary  highlighted the  concept of  the sub-fund  for the                                                                   
CBRF.  She  detailed  that  currently  the  CBRF  had  a  100                                                                   
percent  cash   equivalent  target   asset  allocation.   She                                                                   
explained  that  there  had  been   a  much  different  asset                                                                   
allocation in  the past, including  monies going to  the sub-                                                                   
fund  in  2008,  which  had  a  significantly  higher  target                                                                   
return.  She  stated  there were  mechanisms  to  invest  the                                                                   
money, but the  sub-fund could only be utilized  if the funds                                                                   
were not needed for about five years.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon pointed  out  that the  CBRF was  also                                                                   
bound  to  certain liquidity  thresholds,  meaning  the  fund                                                                   
could not  be invested as  a more diversified  portfolio like                                                                   
the pension  funds. He stated  in essence the  department was                                                                   
bound to a low earning, stable, and low risk fund.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary agreed it was true for the main [CBRF] fund.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon thought  it was  interesting that  the                                                                   
state's  primary  savings  account appeared  to  be  outdated                                                                   
relative to  other existing funds  that were nimbler  and had                                                                   
a higher  earning capability.  He recalled  in 1990  when the                                                                   
CBRF was viewed  as the state's fiscal plan  where every last                                                                   
dollar was  swept into the  "concrete vault"  the legislature                                                                   
could  not access  without a  three-quarter  vote. He  stated                                                                   
that times  changed and continued  to change. He  pointed out                                                                   
that the  Permanent  Fund may  have been in  its best  return                                                                   
decade  possibly  ever,  which  everyone hoped  was  not  the                                                                   
case.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:36:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Wool  recalled a court decision  had been made                                                                   
that  settlement money  was deposited  into  the CBRF,  which                                                                   
helped  build up  its  balance. He  stated  it was  different                                                                   
than  the original  fund structure.  He  used a  hypothetical                                                                   
example  where  the  funds  from  a  $50  million  settlement                                                                   
between the state  and an oil tax corporation  were deposited                                                                   
into  the CBRF.  He believed  the court  decision had  helped                                                                   
build up the CBRF.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter  agreed  the  mechanism   existed;  however,  he                                                                   
clarified it  was written into  the constitution and  was not                                                                   
the  result  of  a court  decision.  He  explained  that  any                                                                   
settlement  of  mineral  leases, bonuses,  rents,  and  other                                                                   
natural  resource type  revenues  were to  be deposited  into                                                                   
the CBRF.  He detailed that any  court cases he was  aware of                                                                   
dealt  with  more  definitional  type matters  such  as  what                                                                   
counted as a bonus sale.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Wool asked if  there were events  that caused                                                                   
the   CBRF  to   grow  apart   from  any   deposits  by   the                                                                   
legislature.  He remarked  that the graph  [showing the  CBRF                                                                   
balance] was flat for many years and then shot up.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Mr.   Fechter   answered   there  had   been   some   sizable                                                                   
settlements  deposited  into  the  fund over  the  years.  He                                                                   
relayed that  in previous  years, when  the CBRF balance  had                                                                   
been  much higher,  the  sub-fund  had a  substantially  more                                                                   
aggressive  asset allocation.  The  fund  had benefited  from                                                                   
positive  investment earnings  over  the years  until it  had                                                                   
been  drawn  down  to  the  current   level.  He  stated  the                                                                   
situation  had   precluded  the  fund  from  having   a  more                                                                   
aggressive, long-term asset allocation.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Representative    Wool   thought    there    was   a    court                                                                   
interpretation  as to  what defined  a  settlement. He  would                                                                   
look into it.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:39:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary addressed  revenue  volatility  on  slide 23.  She                                                                   
relayed  that  projected  FY  22  revenue  was  comprised  of                                                                   
approximately 65  percent investment earnings and  25 percent                                                                   
petroleum  revenues.  She  detailed   there  was  uncertainty                                                                   
every  year regarding  petroleum  revenues due  to price  and                                                                   
production  fluctuation and volatility.  There was  certainty                                                                   
related  to investment  fund earnings  for FY  23 due  to the                                                                   
lagging POMV  formula associated  with money coming  from the                                                                   
ERA; however, there  was investment return uncertainty  in FY                                                                   
24  and beyond.  She  noted that  volatility  had played  its                                                                   
part  over  the years  in  terms  of  the amount  of  revenue                                                                   
coming into the state.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:40:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  moved   to  slide  24  and   reviewed  volatility                                                                   
management techniques.  She detailed  that access  to savings                                                                   
funds  and other  funds had  helped with  the situation.  She                                                                   
remarked  that fiscal tools  could be  modernized to  include                                                                   
lines of  credit in addition  to revenue anticipation  notes.                                                                   
She  noted  there  was current  legislation  that  would  add                                                                   
lines  of  credit. Other  techniques  included  managing  the                                                                   
timing  of ERA  transfers to  the General  Fund and  managing                                                                   
timing  of   expenditures.  She  elaborated  that   the  Cash                                                                   
Management  team closely  managed  cash flows  and money  was                                                                   
only taken  from the ERA when  it was needed.  The department                                                                   
managed  the timing  of expenditures  as it  had done  in the                                                                   
past with  the Public  Education  Fund, which  used to  be an                                                                   
annual  draw at  the beginning  of July  but had  moved to  a                                                                   
quarterly and monthly draw.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Foster  noted that  Representative LeBon  had joined                                                                   
the meeting.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative LeBon  asked about the status of  HB 92 and SB
73  related  to  lines of  credit  and  revenue  anticipation                                                                   
notes.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Fechter answered  that the  bills had  passed the  House                                                                   
and were currently in the Senate Finance Committee.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Leary turned  to slide 25 and provided  takeaways on cash                                                                   
flows.  She stated  that even  with balanced  budgets and  if                                                                   
all revenue was  received, cash flow timing  mismatches would                                                                   
continue to occur  throughout the year. She  highlighted that                                                                   
like  most  forecasting,  cash flow  forecasting  was  always                                                                   
wrong. She  relayed that  revenue shortfalls  could occur  if                                                                   
forecasted  assumptions  were   wrong.  Additionally,  higher                                                                   
revenue  volatility  required  greater  cash  reserves  until                                                                   
volatility   decreased.  She   stated  the   good  news   was                                                                   
volatility management techniques were available.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Foster  noted  that  Representative  Carpenter  had                                                                   
joined the meeting.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon  thought it  would  be interesting  to                                                                   
see  the  historical  percentage  of UGF  funding  for  state                                                                   
government, beginning  the late  1970s when oil  first flowed                                                                   
through  the  pipeline and  the  state  income tax  had  been                                                                   
repealed around  1982. He referenced the current  UGF revenue                                                                   
estimated  at  65 percent  investment  earnings,  25  percent                                                                   
petroleum  revenues, and 10  percent non-petroleum  revenues.                                                                   
He   thought   someone   along   the   way,   including   the                                                                   
legislature,  deserved a pat  on the back  for playing  a big                                                                   
role  in  reducing  the  volatility.  He  reasoned  that  the                                                                   
Permanent   Fund  performance   had  been   great,  and   the                                                                   
legislature had  put a significant  amount of money  into the                                                                   
fund  via  special  appropriations  and  inflation  proofing.                                                                   
Additionally,  the legislature  had not  taken the  allowable                                                                   
50  percent  each  year  for  spending  on  the  capital  and                                                                   
operating  budget. He believed  it was  significant  that the                                                                   
state's  volatility  picture   had  been  reduced  via  sound                                                                   
financial management.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:45:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Edgmon  looked at  slide  15 related  to  the                                                                   
PERS and TRS  investment allocations and returns.  He pointed                                                                   
to  the  bottom  of the  slide,  which  showed  an  actuarial                                                                   
assumed  rate of  return of  7.38  percent. He  asked if  the                                                                   
rate was higher than the Permanent Fund.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Leary  answered  that  the  actuarial  assumed  rate  of                                                                   
return was  part of the  economic assumptions that  went into                                                                   
identifying  the funding  status  of the  pension plans.  The                                                                   
number  was one  of the  department's targets  and there  was                                                                   
another   target  of  6.89   percent   based  on  the   asset                                                                   
allocation,  which differed  from APFC.  She elaborated  that                                                                   
APFC  was  at CPI  plus  5  percent  (above 6  percent).  She                                                                   
continued that the  pension funds and the Permanent  Fund had                                                                   
well-diversified   allocations,   but  each   had   different                                                                   
purposes, liquidity  needs, and structures. She  informed the                                                                   
committee  that the  7.38  percent had  been  derived in  the                                                                   
last   experience  study   the  pension   plans  and   Alaska                                                                   
Retirement  Management  Board  (ARMB)  were  currently  going                                                                   
through  to   determine  the  number  for   future  actuarial                                                                   
determinations.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Representative    Edgmon   thought    it   illustrated    the                                                                   
unpredictability  of inflows  and  outflows.  He pointed  out                                                                   
that healthcare  costs could  rise unexpectedly.  He referred                                                                   
to money coming  in from Tier I and II employees.  He guessed                                                                   
there  were still  over 30,000  people  participating in  the                                                                   
plan. He  compared the  pension plans  to the Permanent  Fund                                                                   
with the  predictable 5  percent annual  payout. He  observed                                                                   
there was much  more unpredictability built into  the pension                                                                   
plans, which he speculated was the reason for the                                                                               
difference in investment strategy.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair    Foster   thanked    the   department    for   its                                                                   
presentation. He reviewed the schedule for the following                                                                        
day.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:48:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The meeting was adjourned at 2:48 p.m.